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Specific Free Edit Discussion (Face Swap)
- Thread starter Eggy
- Start date
If I needed something or am stuck on my work in PS, I either try to get help on the net or ask someone here. If I have not asked, it only means that I did not yet realise there is something to be asked. I am also under the hope that if I am doing something wrong, there are so many experts here who would point out what I had been doing wrong.
I have always taken feedback received here in a positive manner to improve my skills. It is a sincere request from me to anyone reading this to please correct me or offer feedback and it will be received with gratitude.
Oh, man!
I am embarrassed now. But, thanks for the kind words @IamSam. I am so glad I found this wonderful resource.JazzyScotsman
Banned
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I was amused by the phrase 'rap on the knuckles'. 
Back when I was taking classes, I had some of the best instructors ever. Our classes were packed with fantastic projects and exercises, but if I'm honest with myself, the place where I learned the MOST...was during our daily critiques. That was where we all gathered in a circle, studied each other's work one at a time, and offered our feedback. The purpose was not to pat each other on the back, but to develop or critical eye, and learn how to give words to what we saw, what needed work, and how to fix the problems. You usually came away with with some seriously-bloody knuckles, but there was never a time when my work didn't improve drastically by the next critique session. 
Back when I was taking classes, I had some of the best instructors ever. Our classes were packed with fantastic projects and exercises, but if I'm honest with myself, the place where I learned the MOST...was during our daily critiques. That was where we all gathered in a circle, studied each other's work one at a time, and offered our feedback. The purpose was not to pat each other on the back, but to develop or critical eye, and learn how to give words to what we saw, what needed work, and how to fix the problems. You usually came away with with some seriously-bloody knuckles, but there was never a time when my work didn't improve drastically by the next critique session. 
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Good point. But this does not happen very often. When I saw how responsive you were to help, then I had no problems offering advice. You were receptive. But there only seems to be a few members who are offering advice. How can we get more of the forums members involved in offering advice and helping out members who post free edits but won't ask for help?
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Again.............exactly!
I can answer this question only from my point of view. I usually do not comment on other's work because I am unsure how the other person would react to unsolicited advise. Another factor is that I do not consider myself to be an expert, so what appears 'not good' to me may have been another person's way of expressing art?
But if asked, I always offer advise - even if it is on a general PS section.
In my opinion, one should search the net for a solution. If not found, they should ask questions on the General PS section. It will be of benefit to everyone.
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They're not going to ask. So how can I get you involved in actively offering help and advice?
Sound advice but that is what you and I might do. But, if they just show up to do free edits and are not aware that they need help and advice, how do we get them help?
Is there a way to add a tick box for every edit done on Free PS Request section reading "Open for critique" which is left unchecked by default. Only those that are looking for serious critique can tick that one - once checked, they should be open to all comments good and bad, especially the scathingly critical ones.
One can only help a person if the person is open to receiving help. The checkbox suggestion lets the world know that the person is seeking comments on the work aimed at improvement. If we offer help to a person when he is not expecting it, then the person offering help is just wasting his time.
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Good idea, I will check in to that.
What if we open the entire forum up to critiques? It would just be a standard for the all forums?
I would love that. I hope others do not mind it too. From what I have seen of members here, all that I came across are open for comments on their work. But it is best to ask. Maybe a poll might help?
Eggy
Retired Moderator
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Let me give you my view in this matter and it is only my personal opinion.
Many years ago (it's not a fairy tail) I started my graphic journey with CorelDraw 3. (Yes, that long ago)
This graphic software contained (still does) Corel PHOTO-PAINT, the little brother of Photoshop enabling me to also learn photo editing and I used it for many years to correct and edit photo's.
I retired from work and was looking for more challenging editing software and bought PS CS6.
When I joined this forum I was totally new at PS and in need of guidance.
Yes, there were tutorials on YouTube and yes, I picked up some there but I had to have a professional advice about the work I performed and mistakes I made. After several months the need for that advice became essential for me because I had nobody to evaluate my work.
By work, I mean things I made that originated from my own imagination using techniques picked up watching tutorials.
I joined this forum and presented the work I was working on.
I was overwhelmed with advice about techniques by staff and senior members...
I stayed, watching what happened on this forum, reading, assimilating...
It is true I combined it with everything I could find on the web, galleries, tutorials and so on.
I kept posting my own work and learned a lot thanks to the staff and willing members.
You may have noticed that I'm always talking about my own work and that's because the Free Request Section didn't exist at that time and when in need of help or assistence I needed to present work created by myself.
Yes, Photoshop can be used in a lot of ways.
Of course I used the techniques I learned in PS to edit and correct photo's too and since PS is better than CorelDraw my work became better.
But what most of you guys forget is that there's an artistic side that I do not find here no more.
Everybody is working on presented pictures on demand. Little bits and adjustments.
Of course I do use PS for that too but...
Nobody seems interested in using his imagination to create a piece of art (yes indeed art..) from scrap.
Learning to be patient with selecting carefully the pictures you might need to make the composite and then the work, the thinking, the creating...
After many hours of work and applying learned techniques and corrections to finally contemplate the work you made.
Then came the moment of presenting it on forum and again the many advices for corrections to come to a piece worth keeping on your hard drive.
When the free request section was created only the serious requests were allowed and I did some challenging free requests too.
When I became an established member I too was allowed to give constructive advice and comments.
When did anyone posted his own created work?
And if posted, I stopped giving advice because it was ignored.
Bottom line, everybody with a medium knowledge of PS can perform work in the Free Request Section.
To earn my comment and 'like', create something, use your imagination...
You can now say 'he's an old nostalgic prick' and maybe I am, but right now, what I wrote came straight from the heart...
Many years ago (it's not a fairy tail) I started my graphic journey with CorelDraw 3. (Yes, that long ago)
This graphic software contained (still does) Corel PHOTO-PAINT, the little brother of Photoshop enabling me to also learn photo editing and I used it for many years to correct and edit photo's.
I retired from work and was looking for more challenging editing software and bought PS CS6.
When I joined this forum I was totally new at PS and in need of guidance.
Yes, there were tutorials on YouTube and yes, I picked up some there but I had to have a professional advice about the work I performed and mistakes I made. After several months the need for that advice became essential for me because I had nobody to evaluate my work.
By work, I mean things I made that originated from my own imagination using techniques picked up watching tutorials.
I joined this forum and presented the work I was working on.
I was overwhelmed with advice about techniques by staff and senior members...
I stayed, watching what happened on this forum, reading, assimilating...
It is true I combined it with everything I could find on the web, galleries, tutorials and so on.
I kept posting my own work and learned a lot thanks to the staff and willing members.
You may have noticed that I'm always talking about my own work and that's because the Free Request Section didn't exist at that time and when in need of help or assistence I needed to present work created by myself.
Yes, Photoshop can be used in a lot of ways.
Of course I used the techniques I learned in PS to edit and correct photo's too and since PS is better than CorelDraw my work became better.
But what most of you guys forget is that there's an artistic side that I do not find here no more.
Everybody is working on presented pictures on demand. Little bits and adjustments.
Of course I do use PS for that too but...
Nobody seems interested in using his imagination to create a piece of art (yes indeed art..) from scrap.
Learning to be patient with selecting carefully the pictures you might need to make the composite and then the work, the thinking, the creating...
After many hours of work and applying learned techniques and corrections to finally contemplate the work you made.
Then came the moment of presenting it on forum and again the many advices for corrections to come to a piece worth keeping on your hard drive.
When the free request section was created only the serious requests were allowed and I did some challenging free requests too.
When I became an established member I too was allowed to give constructive advice and comments.
When did anyone posted his own created work?
And if posted, I stopped giving advice because it was ignored.
Bottom line, everybody with a medium knowledge of PS can perform work in the Free Request Section.
To earn my comment and 'like', create something, use your imagination...
You can now say 'he's an old nostalgic prick' and maybe I am, but right now, what I wrote came straight from the heart...
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It's always been an acceptable practice to ask about critiques (both ways). However, we are dealing with a different situation here.
Even though someone may be completing a free edit, they are still posting work. That work may need to be improved but they may never know unless our forum members speak out. If we stick to the normal practice, then those who need help will never receive it.
Even though someone may be completing a free edit, they are still posting work. That work may need to be improved but they may never know unless our forum members speak out. If we stick to the normal practice, then those who need help will never receive it.
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Excellent! No one does this anymore..............it's just free edits.
@Eggy, it has been wonderful reading about your journey and I understand better what perspective you are coming from.
I note that you seem worried about reduced "Own creative works" such as composites and works of art created from scratch through an artist's imagination. That is true art, I respect that and appreciate it. I am filled with awe when I see some of the works some members presented in the old threads, such as the 'Liquify Thread'.
Some people have more of a logical bent of mind rather than artistic. Such people make better programmers than artists. I come from such a background. My artistic skills are nil and my interest levels in trying to achieve them are low. I enjoy the challenges in solving problems and PS requests helps me in that. It is pure application of logical parts of the brain with a little help from creative parts areas.
If I am asked to create a composite, my skills are rusty. Though I would love to have that skill in my quiver, my approach will be to learn it 'when the time comes' rather than have it as a first preference like a person with an artistic bent of mind. I am sure there are many artistic people out there that have their Right-Brain dominating the Left. If I am given a bare hand and asked to create a clothing sleeve through pure design, I would not be able to achieve that. That is a limitation of mine that I am aware of and thus concentrate on building other strengths.
Also, PS is a hobby that I seriously indulge in and it is not a primary skill I develop that would get me placed in a job. Hence, my focus is limited to photo tweaks, making accurate selections, playing with light and dark areas, blending modes, Clone Stamps, etc. Even while I limit myself to this at this stage, there are numerous tools that I have not used or learnt so far.
I hope @Eggy and @IamSam are seeing where I and maybe some others are coming from in our perspectives.
I note that you seem worried about reduced "Own creative works" such as composites and works of art created from scratch through an artist's imagination. That is true art, I respect that and appreciate it. I am filled with awe when I see some of the works some members presented in the old threads, such as the 'Liquify Thread'.
Some people have more of a logical bent of mind rather than artistic. Such people make better programmers than artists. I come from such a background. My artistic skills are nil and my interest levels in trying to achieve them are low. I enjoy the challenges in solving problems and PS requests helps me in that. It is pure application of logical parts of the brain with a little help from creative parts areas.
If I am asked to create a composite, my skills are rusty. Though I would love to have that skill in my quiver, my approach will be to learn it 'when the time comes' rather than have it as a first preference like a person with an artistic bent of mind. I am sure there are many artistic people out there that have their Right-Brain dominating the Left. If I am given a bare hand and asked to create a clothing sleeve through pure design, I would not be able to achieve that. That is a limitation of mine that I am aware of and thus concentrate on building other strengths.
Also, PS is a hobby that I seriously indulge in and it is not a primary skill I develop that would get me placed in a job. Hence, my focus is limited to photo tweaks, making accurate selections, playing with light and dark areas, blending modes, Clone Stamps, etc. Even while I limit myself to this at this stage, there are numerous tools that I have not used or learnt so far.
I hope @Eggy and @IamSam are seeing where I and maybe some others are coming from in our perspectives.
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This posting serves as the exact example of what I have been discussing.
We have a level C member who can't discern what's a good edit or one that need's some help, they give "likes" and praises.
We have a level A member asking permission to offer help. Hopefully they will accept.
We have a level B member who has only posted 3 times and all in the Free Edit forum. They need some help to improve.
We have a level C member who can't discern what's a good edit or one that need's some help, they give "likes" and praises.
We have a level A member asking permission to offer help. Hopefully they will accept.
We have a level B member who has only posted 3 times and all in the Free Edit forum. They need some help to improve.
mmm in my opinion you dont need his permission to critic or help in his work, as you said he can choose to accept the advice or ignored, i think you can post your opinion or criticism that not only could help him.. can help more people aswell no need to ask for it. Just my opinion 
