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Ouch at 56k there Allister... hooboy... please don't bother....anyhoo I just visited the Universe forums to which there would appear to be more complaints than good stuff regarding the modeling tools, so other than what would seem to be the worlds best render engine there is nothing that interests me thus I seriously think I am going to pass on this one... sorry to get any excited... man, I still can't believe the worx posted in their gallery though... such realism in so many of the models... oh well...ugggggg  

with regards to C4D, well Stu is no doubt the resident mystro concerning this app and will no doubt be more than able to answer your questions here... I only have C4D v5 and it is totaly different than v6/7 and/or 8...

Damn, back to the beginning... I was really excited about such nice rendering re-Universe, but if the modeling tools are not as intuitive as say Wings or W.H.Y then what can ya do eh?

When you get all of this stuff sorted out please do let us know which you have decided on and perhaps we can all texture, light and render a model done up by one of us, this way seeing just what is what within the scope of our limited experience of course      [excited]

Good luck Allister... I really feel for you... too many choices, time ticking bye...